Don’t Ask Philip Klein About ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’

I know that our government cannot be bothered to even consider the consider the views of the people who the proposed repeal of “Don’t ask, don’t tell” will directly affect the most (our troops) but I will give a few of them the chance to air their views on this controversial subject, starting with this eloquent writer, Iraq War veteran & former U.S. Marine. Other veterans respond in the comments below this article, representing both different points of view.

 Don’t Ask Philip Klein About ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’

By

Philip Klein has argued yet again for openly gay military service. “As somebody who doesn’t view gayness as a big deal one way or the other,” Klein wrote yesterday, “I honestly have trouble seeing the problem with allowing gays to openly serve in the military.”

Klein, I believe, is an honorable man. His indifference to this issue is no doubt sincere and, unfortunately, widely shared by many on the Right. So let me try to explain why conservatives such as myself — especially those who serve in the U.S. military, and in particular the combat arms — are so riled by this issue.

First off, our opposition to openly gay military service has nothing to do with fear or prejudice against homosexuals. Yet this line of argument has been propagated and accepted by the cultural and policy elite. Hence the Pentagon’s silly effort to “study” the issue so as to better understand the “feelings” of military service personnel.

But you don’t need a study to realize that the vast majority of our military personnel don’t give a damn if you’re gay. By the same token, however, most military personnel recognize that being gay is not at all like being black, Jewish, Hispanic or Asian. And the reason, as Colin Powel observed in 1993, is simple:

Skin color [and ethnicity are] benign, non-behavioral characteristic[s]. Sexual orientation, [by contrast], is perhaps the most profound of human behavioral characteristics. Comparison of the two is a convenient but invalid argument.

Yet Klein and the cultural and policy elite suggest that sexual yearnings and sexual appetites are of no consequence. After all, they argue, so long as we enforce strict codes of conduct, there will be no problems with openly gay military service.

Please. Only someone who has never served in the U.S. military and who has never been to high school or college could make such a ludicrous argument. Sexual yearnings and sexual appetites are of tremendous consequence; and they profoundly shape human behavior.

I could cite examples from my own modest experience as a Marine to show specifically how and why sexual dynamics (between men and women) adversely shape behavior and disrupt teamwork and unit effectiveness. My experience, however, is not atypical.

Suffice it to say that how military personnel feel about gay men and women is utterly irrelevant. What matters greatly is the introduction of an overt sexual dynamic into an overwhelmingly young and healthy male population. The problem with openly gay military service is that it puts the full force of law behind this dynamic while dishonestly pretending that sexuality doesn’t affect human behavior.

Yet ironically, Klein writes, “My political philosophy also leads me to believe that issues of sexual morality aren’t the concern of government, which means that on some issues I reach the same conclusions as liberals…”

Well, give Klein credit for honesty. He’s not afraid to admit that he’s at one with the Left on social issues. But if issues of sexual morality aren’t the concern of government — and I quite agree that they are not — then why is Klein urging the government to grant special legal protection to homosexuals? Why does he think homosexuals should be singled out for special protective status?

After all, gay men and women can and do serve now in the U.S. military — provided they keep their private sexual lives private. The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Adm. Mike Mullen, says this policy (‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’) is wrong because it forces gay men and women to “lie” about their sexual status.

But that’s not really true — or at least the policy is not as bad or as onerous as Adm. Mullen suggests. Most commanders, after all, are loath to initiate separation procedures against a gay military member unless and until that member makes an issue of their sexuality.

In fact, the ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’ policy requires gay men and women to be discreet about their sexual status. Big deal. Excuse me for not thinking that this is a terrible and grave injustice wrongly inflicted upon patriotic lesbians and homosexuals.

In any case, the issue is not one of sexual morality (though unlike Klein, I do think morality matters); it is one of human nature, human behavior and group dynamics. Heterosexual dynamics within the military certainly can be, and often are, disruptive. However, homosexual dynamics would be even more disruptive given most people’s natural antipathy toward homosexual acts.

A shared sense of manhood, after all, is integral to the military culture, especially in the combat arms. But what happens to that culture when it becomes known as a hospitable redoubt for gay men and women? It would be naïve to think that this won’t have an effect on recruiting, retention and combat effectiveness.

Yet, Klein decries conservatives’ “inordinate focus on homosexuality.” Would that it were so! In fact, as Klein well knows, most conservatives have been reticent to oppose the gay lobby. Their reticence is attributable in part to crass political motives (the omnipotent polls show that everyone’s now in favor of so-called gay rights), and in part to the fact that many conservatives have bought into the propaganda and deception of the gay lobby.

But before we force a dramatic policy change and cultural transformation upon the U.S. military, we might want to reflect deeply upon human nature and human sexuality, and their effects upon human behavior: Because the reality is that we are not automatons; we are sentient beings. And our sentient nature profoundly affects individual behavior and group dynamics, and not always for the better.

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14 Responses to Don’t Ask Philip Klein About ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’

  1. polarbear20 says:

    I know that our government cannot be bothered to even consider the consider the views of the people

    Oh shut up!! Seriously, if anyone has a problem with being around gay people, working with them, serving with them, etc; they do not DESERVE to have their views considered. Screw ’em!! It would be like an article whining about how They’re ignoring the views of the people who the proposed desegregation of the military will directly affect the most. Just like with supporting segregation and not allowing gay marriage, there is no rational, intelligent defense for the open discrimination our military has committed each day for close to twenty years. Thus, I have little to no respect for anyone who chooses to support discrimination. And if the government wants to ignore these people, I have that much more respect for them. Finally a government rejecting right wing christen prejudice, not making it the rule of law.

    But seriously, these “defenses” for leaving the current institutional discrimination as is are weak. I was watching Rachel Maddow last night and there’s actually someone out there who suggested we not end discrimination against gays because of the problem with “how would parents explain it to their children?” It’s as if we’re having a debate between smart, adult progressives and children.

    I only had time to skim this right now, I’ll be coming back. But basically I can say whatever you say about sexual appetites, all is true between men and women as well. So maybe we should have straight men work with straight men, straight women work with straight women only. And gay men, pair them with gay women and reverse. Or just ban heterosex and homosex both in the military and make a new policy of monosex only. 😀

  2. Princess says:

    as usual PB, you believe that someone’s ELSE’S rights (particularly the people you think are the victims) trump everyone else’s.

  3. mzkatie says:

    So, I’ve gathered that this author opposes the repeal of DADT because homosexual orientation is a personality trait that is more disruptive than heterosexual orientation, which could affect teamwork & unit effectiveness, individual behavior, group dynamics, recruiting, retention, combat effectiveness, & of course, a shared sense of manhood, & that these effects “may not be for the better.”

    Like PB has already stated, none of these “defenses” are a justification for discrimination. I agree with the author that DADT is not or a catastrophic, tragic emergency. But it IS discrimination. Again like PB already stated, I sincerely have little respect for those who support discrimination.
    The Land of the Free & the Home of the Brave. Free men & women. Brave men & women. Nothing about straight men & women.

    As for his “may not be for the better” remark, I can only say.. you never know. You never know.. that gay guy could also be a diehard Browns or Steelers fan, & he may have season tickets he likes to share with his buddies. He might be just as dedicated to physical fitness & be able to whoop your ass by a minute in a mile run or have a wicked golf swing. His beloved mother may also be fighting the long battle against ovarian cancer. He may share the some of the same ideas, traits, interests, life events, & whatnot as a straight person. Homosexuality IS a personality trait, but it is NOT a trait that we should focus on so severely.

  4. therealgirlscout says:

    Ms Katie – you are the coolest conservative that I know! 🙂

  5. Princess says:

    & you think that straight people will become “victims” to displays of homosexuality, don’t you? katie, come on now. do you really think i’m THAT stupid? PLEASE!
    homosexuality is CHOSEN……..it is THAT SIMPLE. it’s CHOSEN for whatever reason.
    just like OBESITY is CHOSEN (which btw would keep one out of the military)
    just like drugs are CHOSEN (which again, would keep one out of the military)
    it is CHOSEN lifestyle…………………..and no amount of whining and cajoling is going to convince the MAJORITY of the AMERICAN people in this DEMOCRACY otherwise.
    just as you katie, have CHOSEN to raise a child on your own (which would also keep you from serving)………….it’s YOUR CHOICE (which i applaud btw). you CHOSE your “lifestyle” and no matter what anyone tells you, you will CHOOSE this lifestyle the REST of your life.
    again, i will never understand why liberals “believe” (damn there’s that WORD again, GAG!) that no one is responsible for their own CHOICES and there are consequences to EVERY choice one makes.

    • polarbear20 says:

      come on now. do you really think i’m THAT stupid?

      That question is the equivalent of a girl asking “Do these jeans make my ass look fat?”. 😀

      homosexuality is CHOSEN……..it is THAT SIMPLE. it’s CHOSEN for whatever reason.

      Bullshit. And even if it were a choice, why should homosexuals be excluded? Drugs or obesity, it’s easy to see how those things can be hazardous for the individual and the organization. But how is who someone sleeps with an issue? Aside from Hacksaw’s homoerotic ‘barrack fantasies’, there’s no real… nothing that says gay people shouldn’t be allowed to serve openly.

      and no amount of whining and cajoling is going to convince the MAJORITY of the AMERICAN people in this DEMOCRACY otherwise.

      The exact same thing can be said about the civil rights movement and even slavery. Some people CHOOSE (there’s that word again!!) to be ignorant mouth breathers despite the facts presented to them. There’s a dense enough concentration of these ignorant people in the south, so we convinced them by force with the Civil Rights Act. I think a new Civil Rights Act for homosexuals is long overdue. This is a racist, bigoted country and it’s our job to drag them kicking and screaming into the 21st century.

    • polarbear20 says:

      You know what the issue really is? FEAR. The walls of “the old way” are falling down fast. They’re afraid that letting gays serve openly will be successful, thus giving people even more of a reason to accept gays and even gay marriage. For too long THEY, the establishment, the right wing, have tried to tell us gays are different, they’re weird, not normal. And since right wingers worship the military, it’s kinda the “pulse” of the nation to them. If the military is opposed to gays, there must be something wrong with them.

  6. therealgirlscout says:

    You can say it until you’re blue in the face, princess. but homosexuals are BORN that way, just like you were born a heterosexual. You CHOOSE to follow your urges of heterosexuality, but you did not CHOOSE to be straight. You are not attracted to the same sex because it is not how you were born. Anymore than gays choose to be attracted to the same sex. They just ARE. Call it genes, DNA, Brain wiring or whatever. They are BORN gay.

  7. Hacksaw says:

    PB – “Bullshit. And even if it were a choice, why should homosexuals be excluded? Drugs or obesity, it’s easy to see how those things can be hazardous for the individual and the organization. But how is who someone sleeps with an issue? Aside from Hacksaw’s homoerotic ‘barrack fantasies’, there’s no real… nothing that says gay people shouldn’t be allowed to serve openly.”

    GS – “You can say it until you’re blue in the face, princess. but homosexuals are BORN that way, just like you were born a heterosexual. You CHOOSE to follow your urges of heterosexuality, but you did not CHOOSE to be straight. You are not attracted to the same sex because it is not how you were born. Anymore than gays choose to be attracted to the same sex. They just ARE. Call it genes, DNA, Brain wiring or whatever. They are BORN gay.”

    Actually, some people do actually “choose” that lifestyle, like Lady Gaga, Elton John, Drew Barrymore, Billie Joe Armstrong, Lindsey Lohan, the late, great Freddie Mercury, Anne Heche, Marlon Brando, Billie Jean King and scores of other people who bounce back & forth between men & women under the guise of being “bisexual” disprove the commonly held belief that everyone who is gay is born that way, and that noone ever chooses to be.

    Who knows, we may even see the PB’s beloved “muff diver” (ya’ll know who 😉 ) kissing on a guy before too long… 😀

    • polarbear20 says:

      “some people do actually choose that lifestyle”

      Exactly!! They choose the LIFESTYLE!! They don’t ‘choose’ to be gay, they choose to listen to their desires. Same way a heterosexual chooses to pursue sexual realtions with someone of the opposite sex, rather than celibacy.

      Whoa, whoa, whoa, that doesn’t “prove” anything. Only thing it does is bring up some evidence that maybe people are born with both hetero and homo sexual tendencies. And different people act on those desires differently.

      Who knows, we may even see the PB’s beloved “muff diver” (ya’ll know who ) kissing on a guy before too long…

      And hopefully that guy would be me!! 😀

  8. Princess says:

    You know what the issue really is? FEAR. you are a MORON PB. fear………LMAO you’re kidding right?
    homosexuals are BORN that way really girly? really? hmmmmm so GOD makes MISTAKES by causing someone to be BORN this way?
    funny how the miracle of birth IS and always HAS been created by GOD. not salamanders or slitherly things “evolving” into humans, but actual BIRTH.
    and yet, you honestly “believe” (that WORD again!) that although it is clear in GOD’S word that homosexuality is an ABOMINATION………..he causes or allows HUMANS to be born this way?
    wow, how TWISTED is this?
    GOD is perfect & does NOT make mistakes. NO ONE is BORN “gay”……………..it is not the NATURAL order of things made by GOD. BABIES are NOT born “gay”.
    it is CHOICE, plain & simple.
    just like CHOOSING chocolate ice cream over vanilla.
    have you been worshiping with Nancy Pelosi?

    • polarbear20 says:

      You know what the issue really is? FEAR. you are a MORON PB. fear………LMAO you’re kidding right?

      Nope. I swear to the nonexistent space god that conservatives are AFRAID of homosexuals. What else could explain this ridiculous homophobic behavior? They’re terrified of gay people so they hold them down. Just like Hispanics. Remember someone on the other site was claiming that strawberry pickers were coming here to rape white women?

      homosexuals are BORN that way really girly? really? hmmmmm so GOD makes MISTAKES by causing someone to be BORN this way?

      If you believe in a deity that ‘creates’ people, then yes the deity does make mistakes. How else would you explain Sarah Palin’s FUCKED UP baby? That’s why once again SCIENCE TRIUMPHS as we map the human genome and understand the causes of different conditions.

      it is clear in GOD’S word that homosexuality is an ABOMINATION

      Oh shut up!! Interracial marriage was “an ABOMINATION” a few decades ago too. Marrying outside one’s social class is “an ABOMINATION” in many cultures as well.

      And that’s not “god’s word” at all. It’s more like the words of some sexually repressed catholic freak in the 1200s. I’m drawing a blank on the name at the moment but I remember the very interesting life story of one of the top religious figures of the early church, around the time they were putting the bible together.

      have you been worshiping with Nancy Pelosi?

      I’ve been banging her. She says “oh god” alot, does that count?? 😉 😉

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